Much better in terms of what? The only country that practice Syariah to a certain extend is Saudi Arabia. Brunei is starting but their monachy is exempted. In what sense the countries you mention are better then these 2?
dont need to talk saudi because they rich in oil and the hajj money coming world wide.
i am talking china, rusia, singapore and america...
no hudud yet they more prospect than malaysia....if the oil dry out in saudi and brunei...you see how it leads..
Huh? What has Hudud got to do with economy? Care to explain?
yes lah....none muslims not comfortable with hudud...hence investors not interested in investing here, if once the hudud implemented...
you think i will go to a country when hudud implemented? no
Anyways Singapore has laws which are harsher than Hudud. Try eating chewing gum or spray graffiti there and see what would happen to you
they do not chop off hand...yes singapore mean business ...they will take action if you lotter around or even pasting the al long sticker...here in malaysia ? look how muslims running this country? every where you see the sticker on of al long and etc...you do not see in singapore...
Of course , in the end God would be the judge but you have already proven yourself to be a liar and a hypocrite.
this how a muslims mind accused...the quran reading peoples.... judge others like god
I thought that avenue was denied to him. Did you not keep up with the circumstance of his trial? This is very poor of you
yet both are muslim....they swear in mosque...so it need to bring syariah court ...remember saifol buat sumpah using quran...why it was not brought to syariah court?
i am talking china, rusia, singapore and america...
no hudud yet they more prospect than malaysia....if the oil dry out in saudi and brunei...you see how it leads..
LOL , why no need to talk about Saudi Arabia and Brunei? As far as it goes , to a certain extent , these 2 countries are the only ones who prescribe to Hudud. Isn't such a fair comparison?
Again I am asking you , in what aspect are the countries you mentioned better than Saudi Arabia and Brunei? The cost of living in these 2 countries is much better then the ones you mentioned.
yes lah....none muslims not comfortable with hudud...hence investors not interested in investing here, if once the hudud implemented...
you think i will go to a country when hudud implemented? no
You are just speculating. Investors come to places where they would make money. This means political stability is most important.
I am asking again . What is your problem with Hudud? ..... well apart from the fact that you are hate Islam but derive your livelihood from the patronage of muslims (we call such person a hypocrite). Can you provide a valid reason? So far nothing from you.
they do not chop off hand...yes singapore mean business ...they will take action if you lotter around or even pasting the al long sticker...here in malaysia ? look how muslims running this country? every where you see the sticker on of al long and etc...you do not see in singapore...
Again and again you display inconsistency in your argument. Some of the laws in Singapore are harsher than Hudud but you are ok with it. You are now trying to change the topic again by talking about governance. I might not agree with the current government but this is not the topic we are talking about.
I am asking you again - can you provide a valid reason of rejecting Hudud? LOL , it is not chopping both hands because of stealing bread therefore cannot 'basuh berak' ...... ha ha
You have been caught lying about your religion which you claim to be an ex muslim
You are a hypocrite as you hate Islam but derive your livelihood with the patronage of muslims
So ..... what goes?
yet both are muslim....they swear in mosque...so it need to bring syariah court ...remember saifol buat sumpah using quran...why it was not brought to syariah court?
Swearing in mosques and holding the Quran has never been a practice in Islam. Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وسلم) has never done such. Such practice is meaningless and it exhibit the ignorance of the person(s). Islam is a practical religion. Provide the proof when making an accusation.
You need to ask the courts of Malaysia why Anwar Ibrahim was denied the syariah courts.
You have been caught lying about your religion which you clai ...
Are you not a liar and a hypocrite?
You have been caught lying about your religion which you claim to be an ex muslim
You are a hypocrite as you hate Islam but derive your livelihood with the patronage of muslims
So ..... what goes?
me liar? how ? did you see my ic? hve you met me? i caught you again with lying tounge...
by creating topic in this forum are all hate islam? did not muslims going around killing the kafir and bomb here and there...so who hate who?
[/quote]
[quote]Swearing in mosques and holding the Quran has never been a practice in Islam. Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وسلم) has never done such. Such practice is meaningless and it exhibit the ignorance of the person(s). Islam is a practical religion. Provide the proof when making an accusation.
so, there is loophole in your followers...worst they can swear infront of object which is kabbah..
You need to ask the courts of Malaysia why Anwar Ibrahim was denied the syariah courts.
why me? i m not muslim....is your duty as muslims to ask the authority...why cannot is it? no balls?
You are just speculating. Investors come to places where they would make money. This means political stability is most important.
nope...you wrong.....in brunei peoples invest because goods are cheap and duty free...even if they have hudud....
here nothing....once hudud implemented...it will backwards..
I am asking again . What is your problem with Hudud? ..... well apart from the fact that you are hate Islam but derive your livelihood from the patronage of muslims (we call such person a hypocrite). Can you provide a valid reason? So far nothing from you.
me hate islam? how? by asking creating this topic me hate islam? you behaving like ISIS..mental block
[/quote][quote]Again and again you display inconsistency in your argument. Some of the laws in Singapore are harsher than Hudud but you are ok with it. You are now trying to change the topic again by talking about governance. I might not agree with the current government but this is not the topic we are talking about.
I am asking you again - can you provide a valid reason of rejecting Hudud? LOL , it is not chopping both hands because of stealing bread therefore cannot 'basuh berak' ...... ha ha
singapore do not chop off hand for stealing...it seems u are inconsistency in your argument...not me..
Truth.8 replied at 28-2-2015 03:18 PM
me liar? how ? did you see my ic? hve you met me? i caught you again with lying tounge...
by creating topic in this forum are all hate islam? did not muslims going around killing the kafir and bomb here and there...so who hate who?
Yes , you are a liar. Aren't you the one who claimed to be a muslim a couple of years ago. Try reading your backdated posts. I am ok if you hate Islam but the arguments you provide at so idiotic that I cannot let it pass by me.
Well , the Christians also go around killing people. LOL , until now do yo know which religion is leading others in killings? Try finding out.
BTW , you are also a hypocrite.
so, there is loophole in your followers...worst they can swear infront of object which is kabbah..
Loophole? I thought I stated the following
Swearing in mosques and holding the Quran has never been a practice in Islam. Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وسلم) has never done such. Such practice is meaningless and it exhibit the ignorance of the person(s). Islam is a practical religion. Provide the proof when making an accusation.
Where is the loophole when such practice has never been part of Islam? Do you know what is the meaning of 'loophole'? By the way these people are not my followers.
why me? i m not muslim....is your duty as muslims to ask the authority...why cannot is it? no balls?
Are you not the one asking for Anwar to be tried in syariah court? He did apply for such but was turned down. Don't you think you should find out the reason or non reason for turning down such application? Why are you so dependent to be spoon fed? You don't have any ability to find out for yourself?
Truth.8 replied at 28-2-2015 03:22 PM
nope...you wrong.....in brunei peoples invest because goods are cheap and duty free...even if they have hudud....
here nothing....once hudud implemented...it will backwards..
In other words you are admitting that there are people who invest in Brunei despite it practicing Hudud or a version of it. Then why did you claim , per your post #82
yes lah....none muslims not comfortable with hudud...hence investors not interested in investing here, if once the hudud implemented...
you think i will go to a country when hudud implemented? no
You are just going around in circles chasing your backside.
LOL , Hudud or a version of it has already been implemented in Brunei .... has it gone backwards? No. You admit that people are willing to invest there. You don't seem to know what you are talking about.
How do you know that Malaysia would be going backwards if Hudud implemented? Pulled that one from your ass again?
me hate islam? how? by asking creating this topic me hate islam? you behaving like ISIS..mental block
LOL , it ia point that you have to look into the mirror and ask yourself. I don't really care if you hate Islam or what not. However the arguments you employ is to a point of misrepresenting Islam and I cannot let it pass. Take for example , you claim that the Quran prohibit befriending Christians and Jews due to a mistranslation. This has been pointed out in numerous occasion yet you recycle the same rubbish over and over again. What is your motive in doing such? However the same concept has been forrwarded in the bible , you seem to ignore it as much as possible. Only haters does that.
singapore do not chop off hand for stealing...it seems u are inconsistency in your argument...not me..
However you get in big trouble for eating gum and you would be caned for graffiti. This is a harsher punishment than Hudud. Therefore the inconsistent one is you and only you.
Yes , you are a liar. Aren't you the one who claimed to be a muslim a couple of years ago. Try reading your backdated posts. I am ok if you hate Islam but the arguments you provide at so idiotic that I cannot let it pass by me.
Well , the Christians also go around killing people. LOL , until now do yo know which religion is leading others in killings? Try finding out.
BTW , you are also a hypocrite.
any proof for such claim? or you kutum make you hayal?
Loophole? I thought I stated the following
Swearing in mosques and holding the Quran has never been a practice in Islam. Prophet Muhammad(صلى الله عليه وسلم) has never done such. Such practice is meaningless and it exhibit the ignorance of the person(s). Islam is a practical religion. Provide the proof when making an accusation.
loophole amoung your umat lah....are you stupid to understand my writings or you pretending?
Are you not the one asking for Anwar to be tried in syariah court? He did apply for such but was turned down. Don't you think you should find out the reason or non reason for turning down such application? Why are you so dependent to be spoon fed? You don't have any ability to find out for yourself?
am i? i was refering that he is muslim as well the saifol...both are muslim...so, why it was not brought to syariah court? what is the function of the syariah court? divorce only , harta only ?
LOL , you are again trying to run from your own claim. Do I need to remind you that in the past threads , you made a claim that you were once muslim. Apa daaa tambi , kalau nak bohong pun , PRO lah sikit.
loophole amoung your umat lah....are you stupid to understand my writings or you pretending?
an error in the way a law, rule, or contract is written that makes it possible for some people to legally avoid obeying it
If you read and understood what I stated is that swearing by the Quran , in mosques in front of Kaabah is NOT a practice in Islam. There is no error in any thing that it can be a loophole exploited by anybody.
How is it that you view it to ba a loophole whereas such is NOT a practice in Islam? You are not drunk .... are you?
am i? i was refering that he is muslim as well the saifol...both are muslim...so, why it was not brought to syariah court? what is the function of the syariah court? divorce only , harta only ?
Huh? You still asking why is it not brought to syariah court? I repeat what I stated (bitpart) in post #81
I thought that avenue was denied to him. Did you not keep up with the circumstance of his trial? This is very poor of you
Why are you still asking why he did not bring the matter to syariah court? Do you know what is the meaning of 'that avenue was denied to him'?
The problem with you is that you have very poor comprehension. You don't even understand what you read and end up asking questions that have already been answered.
I am still waiting : Can you provide a valid reason for rejecting Hudud?
By sam:
LOL , you are again trying to run from your own claim. Do I need to remind youthat in the past threads , you made a claim that you were once muslim. Apa daaatambi , kalau nak bohong pun , PRO lah sikit.
------
By truth.8
No proof no talk….just like in court , u need to bring evidence not just accusing without proof..
an error in the way a law, rule, or contract is written thatmakes it possible for some people to legally avoid obeying it
--------
by truth.8
ok, fine….meaning in islamic country like Malaysia there is a loophole with regards to the teachings of islam? Am I right?
-----------------------------
By sam:
If you read and understood what I stated is that swearing bythe Quran , in mosques in front of Kaabah is NOT a practice in Islam. There isno error in any thing that it can be a loophole exploited by anybody.
By truth.8
Ok understood.So there is element of wrong doing in your umat when Malaysia being Islamic country just ignore it? Why the authority such as JAIS, Jakim and few other Islamic body just close one eye with regards to such wrong doing done by the muslim in public with media and etc?
If such mistake done, not accordance to the teachings of Quran , how you going implement hudud because the incident which swearing sumpah laknat’ holding Quran and swear infront of an object which kabbah not part of the teachings of islam….do see how the teachings of islam has been manipulated by your umat ? so, for such small issue , what make you think can implement hudud? They even can manipulate the hudud when the authority will keep silent without sayings (tegur) for their wrong doing?
You can’teven clean up the mess done by the musims here and thinking of implementing hudud .Do you think it work?
That why I says, itwill be great disaster if hudud implement in Malaysia for many reason besidesit is also outdated..
-----
By sam:
How is it that you view it to ba a loophole whereas such is NOT a practice inIslam? You are not drunk .... are you?
---------
By Truth.8
Are you denying that muslims are doing it not accordance with the teachings of islam ? where does the loophole came and why it was not stop? Where is authority?
---------------
By sam:
Huh? You still asking why is it not brought to syariah court? I repeat what I stated (bitpart) in post #81
-------------
Helloooooooooooooooooooooooo....didyou understand what I have written? Or amI debating with a 4 years child here???
What isthe function of syariah court which govern by the King…is syariah court only handles divorce case, will dispute (harta),converting only?
Why is thecase of rape, zina and liwat which done by muslims among muslims not brought to Islamic syariah court but was refer to British law in Malaysia?
Please answer me in professional manner . thank you
------
By sam:
Why are you still asking why hedid not bring the matter to syariah court? Do you know what is the meaning of'that avenue was denied to him'?
-------
By truth.8
Tell me what the meaning of avenue ? if you think the socalled avenue was denied, did not it show how weak is the syariah court ? …and yet you muslims talk so much about hudud here when the syariah court look weak
--------
By sam:
The problem with you is that you have very poor comprehension. You don't even understand what you read and end up asking questions that have already been answered.
--------
By truth.8
How can I be poor in comprehension when you have debated inthis thread very long ? the pages now 4…does it look poor in comprehension toyou? Or you giving an excuses to run away from answering me in logical point ofview?
Me waiting…
----------
By sam:
I am still waiting : Can youprovide a valid reason for rejecting Hudud?
----------
By truth.8
….and you still asking a question which already answered….as usual u are in denial….
No proofno talk….just like in court , u need to bring evidence not just accusingwithout proof..
Thank you
LOL , lets see what you claim in this thread , your post#3
not sure yet but my identity card still hold my muslim name. wonderful name indeed I got. It means light and heaven.
As I mentioned, I will died as secret followers of Christ but in muslim cemetery.
What to do, everything by force.:agr:
Your post#10
cannot lah.....:cry:i hve try many method. going to syariah court is waste of time because they ask to attend stupid counceseling.
each time i forward questions....they unable to answer my questions. some even feel doubth about their faith after i forward many questions on islam.
what to do .....:cry:
Ha ha , you don't even know the most basic of Islam yet you tried to lie that you are an ex muslim. Like I said , kalau nak bohong pun - PRO lah sikit. You claim the bible is the truth but you are scared to take up the challenge of Mark16:18.
ok, fine….meaning in islamiccountry like Malaysia there is a loophole with regards to the teachings of islam? Am I right?
If you know what is the meaning of loophole , you would not ask such a stupid question. I already stated that swearing by the Quran or in mosques is not in the Quran nor its the action of Prophet Muhammad(saw). Why are you talking about a practice that is not in the Quran nor the sunnah? How can it be a loophole when such practice is not even in the doctrine of the religion? Can you think before you argue?
Ok understood.So there is element of wrong doing in our umat when Malaysia being Islamic statejust ignore it? Why the authority such as JAIS, Jakim and fewother Islamic body just close one close with regards to such wrong doing when this wrong done in public with media and etc?
If such mistake done, not accordance to the teachingsof Quran , how you going implement hudud because the incident whichswearing sumpah laknat’ holding Quranand swear infront of an object which kabbah not part of the teachings of islam….do see how the teachings of islamhas been manipulated by your umat ? so, for such small issue , what make you think can implement hudud? They even can manipulate the hudud when the authority will keep silentwithout sayings (tegur) for theirwrong doing?
You can’teven clean up the mess done by the musims here and thinking of implementing hudud.Do you think it work?
That why I says, itwill be great disaster if hudud implement in Malaysia for many reason besidesit is also outdated..
What Jakim is doing or not doing is not the argument here. You asked about 'sumpah laknat' which is actually 'Mubahalah' and the process is actually very simple. In fact 'Mubahalah' is a way to solve religious dispute. That is why very few people (apart from the people who stands to gain) pay attention to the so called 'sumpah laknat' done by some people. Of course , you don't know because of your lack of reading.
How can it be any worth of very few pay attention to the so called 'sumpah laknat'. Therefore your point of manipulation is not even an argument to begin with. Even Jakim did not pay attention to the so called 'sumpah laknat' of people holding the Quran lah , in mosques lah in front of kaabah lah. Dey tambi , the Quran is for us to read and understand , no to hold and 'sumpah laknat'.
What has 'sumpah laknat' by holding the Quran , in mosques and in front of Kaabah got to do with Hudud? Hudud has it specific documented terms and conditions.
Are you indenying that muslims are doing it not accordance with the teachings of islam ? where does the loopholecame and why it was not stop? Where is authority?
People can do whatever they want like holding the Quran and making 'sumpah laknat'. There is never such teaching in the Quran. The Quran is to be read and be understood , not waving it while 'sumpah laknat'. These people do not apostatise by doing such but they are displaying their ignorance by doing so. Again I ask , where is the loophole for something that not even a doctrine of the religion? If the said person wants to make a fool of himself ..... go ahead
Helloooooooooooooooooooooooo....didyou understand what I have written? Or amI debating with a 4 years child here???
What isthe function of syariah court which govern by the King…is syariah court only handles divorce case, will dispute (harta),converting only?
Why is thecase of rape, zina and liwat which done by muslims among muslimsnot brought to Islamic syariah court but was refer to British law in Malaysia?
Please answerme in professional manner . thank you
Your answer shows that you do not know what you are talking about. Typical of 'truth.8' , nearly 50 years of age but having a mentality of a primary school kid. Rape , Zina , liwat etc if handled in syariah court means that Huhud has to be implemented. However our constitution is based on secular law. Inclusion of Hudud means that the constitution needs to be amended. That is why PAS is trying to push for the amendment of the constitution for the inclusion and implementation of Hudud in Kelantan. There is no Hudud in divorce and / or 'harta' cases. In fact , there is no Hadd punishment for apostacy in the Quran , hence no Hudud.
Don't you think you should take the trouble to find out first before asking such a question. This has been debated at length by the late Karpal Singh who felt that Hudud is a breach to the constitution of this country. This really shows that you are a person who is not bothered to find out what is happening around him but then start asking stupid questions and calling them 'killer question or soalan maut'.
Tell me what themeaning of avenue ? if you think the socalled avenue was denied, did not it show how weak is the syariah court ? …and yet you muslims talk so much about hudud here when the syariah court look weak
LOL , again you are asking a question that only people of lesser intelligence would ask. Refer to the explanation above.
How can I be poor in comprehension when you have debated inthis thread very long ? the pages now 4…does it look poor in comprehension toyou? Or you giving an excuses to run away from answering me in logical point ofview?
Your argument so far has got no logic. You don't even know the constitution of this country with respect the Hudud. You are arguing blind as usual. LOL , you don't even know what is 'loophole' yet you claim not the have comprehension issues? You are just trying to bring others to your level of stupidity and try to beat them with your experience.
….and you still asking a question which already answered….as usual u are in denial….
Ok then , provide your so called answers and I would just copy paste my argument. Until now you are so scared to provide a valid reason in your rejection of Hudud.
Truth.8 replied at 3-3-2015 05:59 PM
are you saying me lying is wrong?
secondly, for hudud issue, let it come to reality ...than we talk ok...
but i doubt because majority do not agree...
I am saying that you are a liar but a lousy one. LOL , what makes you think anyone would believe that you are an ex muslim?
Whether Hudud comes to reality or not is not an issue to me. I want you to give me a valid reason of your rejection of Hudud. So far nothing from you but your argument that both hands cut off because of stealing bread and then cannot 'basuh berak'.
...but i lie because I learn from muslims and the teachings of islam.....in islam it teaches one can lie ...here is verses:
Bukhari (49:857) - "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar." Lying is permitted when the end justifies the means.
Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.
My Bible never teaches me to lie but i learned from muslims...
Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. What part of Thou SHALT NOT dont they understand???? There are NO EXCEPTIONS.... EVER.... To say there are exceptions is to call God a liar.
Whether Hudud comes to reality or not is not an issue to me. I want you to give me a valid reason of your rejection of Hudud. So far nothing from you but your argument that both hands cut off because of stealing bread and then cannot 'basuh berak'.
reason already provided....you in denial...but the hudud will never come to reality in malaysia...that for sure....
Truth.8 replied at 4-3-2015 10:45 AM
...but i lie because I learn from muslims and the teachings of islam.....in islam it teaches one can lie ...here is verses:
Bukhari (49:857) - "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar." Lying is permitted when the end justifies the means.
Qur'an (16:106) - Establishes that there are circumstances that can "compel" a Muslim to tell a lie.
My Bible never teaches me to lie but i learned from muslims...
Exo 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour. What part of Thou SHALT NOT dont they understand???? There are NO EXCEPTIONS.... EVER.... To say there are exceptions is to call God a liar.
Ha ha , again and again your woeful comprehension has let you down :
Bukhari 3:49:857
Narrated Um Kulthum bint Uqba:
That she heard Allah's Apostle saying, "He who makes peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things, is not a liar."
Do you know what is the context of making peace between the people by inventing good information or saying good things? If you don't know , you might as well go back to primary 6 where you belong.
Quran16:106
Whoever disbelieves in Allah after his belief... except for one who is forced [to renounce his religion] while his heart is secure in faith. But those who [willingly] open their breasts to disbelief, upon them is wrath from Allah , and for them is a great punishment;
Do you know what is the context of the underlined? Again if you don't know , go back to primary 6 - where you belong.
Where does it state that Islam teaches that lying is OK?
Your God in the bible is a deceiver or liar
1kings22:22 (NIV)
“‘By what means?’ the Lord asked.
“‘I will go out and be a deceiving spirit in the mouths of all his prophets,’ he said.
“‘You will succeed in enticing him,’ said the Lord. ‘Go and do it.’
Biblical Jesus , your God man lied , joh7:8-10
8 You go to the festival. I am notgoing up to this festival, because my time has not yet fully come.”
9 After he had said this, he stayed in Galilee.
10 However, after his brothers had left for the festival, he went also, not publicly, but in secret.
You in following the the actions of the God(s) of the bible also lie - it being your claim to be a former muslim. Like I say , kalau nak bohong pun - PRO lah sikit.
reason already provided....you in denial...but the hudud will never come to reality in malaysia...that for sure....
LOL , your reasons are at best nonsense. An example , to you Hudud means chopping off both hands just for stealing bread therefore cannot 'basuh berak'. I asked you for a valid reason not a nonsensical reason. Psssst ..... you know the difference between a valid and nonsensical reason?
Hudud becoming a reality is not my concern at the moment. I want you to give me a valid reason of your objection. So far its all about 'cannot basuh berak'.
Post time 27-2-2015 06:49 PM
Author
Helloooooooooooooooooooooooo....didyou understand what I have written? Or amI debating with a 4 years child here???
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