Sebab kenapa Muhammad dan Jesus tak harus diterima menurut Hinduism.

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

I have never missed a single Friday Prayer (except during my travelling days in which I do attend the masjid whenever I can), and I've never heard the khatib speaks ill of other religion.

You are not a proof that your religion is so damn pure. You are just one person in one place at any time. I will not accept you as a proof.

they answered it on Youtube, on live TV, and on open TV forum. They have their own websites, they accepts emails (though they don't have enough energy to answer all), and they open classes which you can attend.

Youtube doesn't ask questions back. TV forum are run by Muslims and those who support Muslims, therefore they could never allow hardcore questions to be aired out of "respect" to Muslims. Website can put whatever nonsense they want, hardly proof of anything and I doubt they could answer all the e-mail. Classes? Most classes about Islam are for those who are interested in joining the cult of Islam, not to answer questions.

Sounds like you don't have confidence in yourself and your religion. That's why you're banking on the 'advantage of being anonymous'. Too bad. It's ok, we don't judge you.

IF you (Muslim terrorists) can apply guerilla tactics against an innocent population, I can apply my tactic against you (Muslims). It is not about confidence, it is about being smart. Meeting any Muslims is not a smart idea.

I didn't refuse to answer it

Yes, you refused to answer it. I failed to see what all these cut and paste stuff is about.

The more you speak ill of Islam, the more people will QUESTION whether what you're saying is true or not. I pray that may Allah give these people path towards learning Islam from the right source and give the the hidayah. I pray the same for you, too.

IF they wish to question me, they know where to find me (here). They are welcome to open a thread and invite me in. Till then, I will continue to fight against Islam and your false god, Allah.

However, the link says that Surah Maryam was revealed in the Makkah (or in the vicinity of Makkah). The link NEVER SAYS that this was sent down in Madinah.

Place maybe wrong, but the fact remains - Muhammad made up his own stuff about Jesus and Mary and in this case, he was forced to do so because the Quraisy were starting to make complains to relevant parties (Christian kings) that Muhammad was abusing Jesus's name and that could mean that Muhammad have to fight two parties. He was not ready for that.

Please show us proof that the status of Jesus Christ was 'changed' by prophet Muhammad s.a.w. in Madinah.

Status of Jesus among Christians is that he is Son of God. Muhammad reduced his level to that of a prophet. Isn't that changing status?

MEANING THAT THE KNOWLEDGE OF ISLAM IS FROM THE QURAN.

No, the knowledge of Islam comes from Muhammad conjuring it up as he went along. That is why it took Muhammad almost 20 years to finish it. No matter what you say, it is impossible for you to proof that the knowledge came from Allah because NO MUSLIMS HAVE EVER SEEN ALLAH.

Tell me, WHO GAVE 'KING MANU' HIS NAME?

Manu is the name given by his parent and the title King was given by his people. Why is that so hard to understand???

Meaning, if a person wants to throw allegations unto Hindu, they must give proof. If not, that is a FITNAH.

No need for proof to through allegations. You only need proof to prove something. And there is plenty of proof to show that Muhammad was nothing more than a good con-artist. You take away Allah and the claims of prophethood, what do you have on Muhammad? NOTHING BUT A CON-ARTIST.

ct_og

Sepiroth ni tak habis-habis memfitnah.. kat sini pun banyak yang dia tulis tak betul ... Alhamdulillah dengan izin Allah, Gunblade712 diberi ilmu dan kesempatan untuk menjawab.

Telah terbukti dunia sendiri telah mengakui Nabi Muhammad saw itu manusia paling berpengaruh dan Nabi Isa yang dipanggil Jesus oleh orang kristian tu juga berpengaruh namun tetap juga dia nak pertikaikan.... kalau ada orang hindu yang HEBAT PERIBADI MENGALAHKAN NABI MUHAMMAD SAW mengapa tidak dia yang dipilih sebagai orang yang paling berpengaruh?

Sephiroth

by ct_og

Telah terbukti dunia sendiri telah mengakui Nabi Muhammad saw itu manusia paling berpengaruh dan Nabi Isa yang dipanggil Jesus oleh orang kristian tu juga berpengaruh namun tetap juga dia nak pertikaikan.... kalau ada orang hindu yang HEBAT PERIBADI MENGALAHKAN NABI MUHAMMAD SAW mengapa tidak dia yang dipilih sebagai orang yang paling berpengaruh?

Kamu tahu tak apa itu kali Yuga? Saya rasa kamu tak cukup ilmu dan akal utk mengetahuinya, jadi aku cakap lah. Kali Yuga bermakna Zaman kegelapan (Yuga itu Zaman). Dlm agama Hindu, ianya mengatakan bahawa dunia kini berada dlm zaman kegelapan di mana manusia tak ubah macam haiwan - tak berperikemanusian, tak berakal dan tak berjiwa.

Oleh itu, manusia yg seakan haiwan ini akan memilih makluk2 sewaktu dgn dia juga sbg pemimpin mereka. Sebab itulah Muhammad dipilih sbg manusia yg terpengaruh walaupun tak ada satu benda berguna pun dia pernah berikan kpd dunia ini dan Jesus yg merupakan WATAK yg dicipta oleh Empire Roman (BUKAN MANUSIA YG BETUL) dijadikan manusia yg berpengaruh. Ianya seolah2 mengatakan bahawa Harry Porter itu manusia yg berpengaruh semata2 kerana buku mengenainya dialihbahasakan dan dijual di seluruh dunia.

Jangan cuba buat kelakar pagi2. Aku tak ada mood lah.

ct_og

Sephiroth posted on 14-11-2013 08:53 AM
by ct_og

Maka dari ayat kamu tu menunjukkan bahawa kita sekarang ni berada dalam zaman kegelapankan? Oleh itu jika benarlah agama hindu tu agama yang benar maka kamu aje la yang jadi orang yang berpengaruh sekarang ni? Ini cabaran pada kamu jika benarlah agama Hindu itu agama yang benar! Cuba kamu jadikan zaman ini ke zaman yang terang kalau kamu benar-benar benar memegang pegangan ajaran hindu!

Sephiroth

by ct_og

Maka dari ayat kamu tu menunjukkan bahawa kita sekarang ni berada dalam zaman kegelapankan?

Dari Bhavagad Gita - Shri Krishna menberitahu Arjuna bahawa bila Dia meninggalkan dunia ini, Kali Yuga akan bermula, dan ianya lebih 5,000 tahun yg lalu.

Cuba kamu jadikan zaman ini ke zaman yang terang kalau kamu benar-benar benar memegang pegangan ajaran hindu!

Bodoh ... Apa benda yg kamu fikir aku sedang lakukan selama satu dekad ini? Main2 tanpa tujuan?

Kamu dilahirkan tanpa tujuan di atas muka bumi ini kerana ibu bapa kamu hanya menpunyai nafsu bila mereka bersatu dan menbuat ibu mu mengandung. Sebab itulah kamu dilahirkan, hidup dan terus mencari arah pedoman serta tujuan di hidup ini.

Tetapi aku tidak spt kau ... sejak aku berumur 10 tahun lagi, aku sudah tahu tujuan hidup aku dan selama 30 tahun ini, aku hidup semata2 kerana tujuan tersebut. Aku hampir mati tetapi hidup balik semata2 kerana tujuan hidup aku belum lagi tercapai dan mustahil aku akan semadi dgn aman selagi kaum ku hidup merana.

Dan aku masih lagi menbujang walaupun dicela (dan aku terimanya dgn senyum) kerana sekiranya aku berkahwin dan beranak, usaha aku menperkuatkan agama dan kaum aku di masa depan nanti akan terbelangkai (kerana aku terpaksa tumpukan perhatian menjaga dan mendidik anak aku nanti).

Dan kau tahu sesuatu tak? Esok lusa, kalau aku berjaya pun, belum tentu aku akan mendapat nama utk usaha dan pengorbanan aku. Tak ada orang akan mengingati aku kerana tak ada orang yg tahu mengenai aku.

kau fikir kamu sembahyang 5 kali sehari itu menjadikan kamu besar sangat ke? Semua yg kau buat itu hanyalah kerana keinginan kau utk hidup senang lenang di syurga nanti. Tak ada rasa cinta terhadap saudara mara seagama dgn kau. Tak ada rasa cinta kpd dunia dan negara. Tak pernah risau ataupun sedih kerana keadaan kaum kau sendiri. Kau fikir kamu hantuk kepala 5 kali sehari, sudah cukup utk kau mengaku diri kau itu beriman.

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 13-11-2013 02:51 PM
by Gunblade712

You are not a proof that your religion is so damn pure. You are just one person in one place at any time. I will not accept you as a proof.

I DID NOT say that to proof that my religion is pure. I've said that just to inform you and the rest of the readers that I have not missed any friday sermons since the prayer was obligated unto me. Since my young days, I HAVE NEVER HEARD A SINGLE SERMONS THAT MOCKS AND LOWERS OTHER RELIGION'S STATUS. NOT EVEN HINDUISM.

Now, seeing that YOU ARE THE ONE WHO CLAIMED THAT WE MOCKED OTHER RELIGIONS DURING FRIDAY PRAYER, YOU SHOULD ALSO GIVE ME PROOF OF SUCH.

If not, it would be best if you stop throwing false allegations and making a fool out of yourself.

Youtube doesn't ask questions back. TV forum are run by Muslims and those who support Muslims, therefore they could never allow hardcore questions to be aired out of "respect" to Muslims. Website can put whatever nonsense they want, hardly proof of anything and I doubt they could answer all the e-mail. Classes? Most classes about Islam are for those who are interested in joining the cult of Islam, not to answer questions.

I agree with Youtube. I also agree with the TV forum that you've said (even though Dr Zakir Naik actually opened his talk to public AND PREFERS THE NON-MUSLIMS TO ATTEND RATHER THAN THE MUSLIMS), but classes? Have you ever ATTEND ONE ISLAMIC CLASS? You can't really say that if you haven't attended even ONE.

I've been to numerous classes where even the non-Muslims attends it. They even asked questions. Hard questions. And the sheikh answered it according to Islamic teachings. Now, question is, are you willing to attend such class and 'show the flaw in Islam', or are you just going to 'fight Islam' behind your pseudonym (which, I believe, you're not doing a very good job other than insulting yourself and your religion)?

IF you (Muslim terrorists) can apply guerilla tactics against an innocent population, I can apply my tactic against you (Muslims). It is not about confidence, it is about being smart. Meeting any Muslims is not a smart idea.

If you check this thread, I have not insulted your religion. Not even once. In fact, I've showed you that Islam prohibits us from insulting your religion. You, on the other hand, insulted me and my religion.

You might disagree, but I believe the rest of the readers can see who's the terrorist here.

Yes, you refused to answer it. I failed to see what all these cut and paste stuff is about.

It's simple; your question was answered in the very verse that you've quoted. Still 'failed to see' the point? It's OK Seph. I've known numerous people, both Muslims and non-Muslims, who only reads half of the Quranic verse and then make conclusions. Usually, these people only makes a fool out of themselves and then they pretend as if they do not understand the answer.

I believe our readers can see how Seph behave.

IF they wish to question me, they know where to find me (here). They are welcome to open a thread and invite me in. Till then, I will continue to fight against Islam and your false god, Allah.

Fighting behind a pseudonym? Well, it's been few years and you didn't harm us nor Allah Himself. In fact, you're only harming yourself. Just look at this thread. We can see that you have no respects to Islam and Muslims (which is not taught by Vedas), you only quoted half of the Quranic verse EVEN THOUGH THE FULL VERSE ACTUALLY ANSWERED YOUR QUESTIONS, and you ignore any questions that you cannot answer.

You're doing a mighty fine job, mate!

Place maybe wrong, but the fact remains - Muhammad made up his own stuff about Jesus and Mary and in this case, he was forced to do so because the Quraisy were starting to make complains to relevant parties (Christian kings) that Muhammad was abusing Jesus's name and that could mean that Muhammad have to fight two parties. He was not ready for that.

No. YOU are wrong. This shows that your previous arguments is nothing but a fitnah from a person who have NO KNOWLEDGE ABOUT ISLAM AND THE QURAN.

Besides, this particular arguments also doesn't make any sense. Have you read Surah Maryam and it says about Jesus Christ (a.s.) and his mother? The surah DENIES THE DIVINITY OF JESUS and even says that GOD CANNOT HAVE A SON. Now, WHICH CHRISTIAN WOULD AGREE TO THAT? If he wanted to wins the Christians, he shouldn't say things which GOES AGAINST THE TEACHINGS OF THE BIBLE.

Please, your argument just doesn't make any sense.

Status of Jesus among Christians is that he is Son of God. Muhammad reduced his level to that of a prophet. Isn't that changing status?

Allow me to repeat my question again :

Please show us proof that the status of Jesus Christ was 'changed' by prophet Muhammad s.a.w. in Madinah.

The question is in response to your allegation on post #56 :

Jews and Christians were supportive of Muhammad when he was in Mecca, therefore, when he qouted from their beliefs, they simply thought that he was doing what all prophets before him was doing, reteaching the people of their beliefs. It is in Madinah did Muhammad started to change the text to his will, and omitted out many things, including the status of Jesus as Son of God and changing the direction of prayers from Jerusalem (which the Jews had been doing for over 500 years) toward Kaabah, which they never had heard or done before. At that time, it was too late. Muhammad already have his war-mongering horde and started to attack and capture areas around Medinah. Jews and Christians fought back with the only way they could - by supporting the Quraisy but the Quraisy are too stupid to do an all-out attack to wipe Muhammad out and lost in return.

No, the knowledge of Islam comes from Muhammad conjuring it up as he went along. That is why it took Muhammad almost 20 years to finish it. No matter what you say, it is impossible for you to proof that the knowledge came from Allah because NO MUSLIMS HAVE EVER SEEN ALLAH.

lol. again, your argument just doesn't make any sense. Islam is based around THE QURAN (first!) and then the Sunnah (second!). He was given the Quran, and hence the Quran is the source of the knowledge in Islam. He talked to the people of Makkah and Madinah with Quranic verse. In fact, there are Quranic verse which refers to the people of Makkah and/or Madinah. Need I mention that the Quran is sent down step by step, and usually there is a story behind the revelation?

IF YOU SAY THAT QURAN IS NOT THE SOURCE, THEN WHICH 'ISLAM' ARE YOU REFERRING TO??

Manu is the name given by his parent and the title King was given by his people. Why is that so hard to understand???

Yes, kinda hard because you blatantly claimed that King Manu and Queen Anusia was the equaivalent of Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve doesn't have any parents, Seph. Now, you're telling me King Manu have parents?

No need for proof to through allegations. You only need proof to prove something. And there is plenty of proof to show that Muhammad was nothing more than a good con-artist. You take away Allah and the claims of prophethood, what do you have on Muhammad? NOTHING BUT A CON-ARTIST.

Lol. shows that there's something's wrong with your ways of thinking. You do not need proof to support an allegations?

Just for the sake of the discussion; taking away Allah and the claim of prophethood, and we have Muhammad the Al-Amin. He was given this title by the people of Makkah LONG BEFORE HIS PROPHETHOOD. What does Al-Amin means? The Trustworthy.

Need I say more?

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 13-11-2013 02:51 PM
by Gunblade712

DAAAANNN.. soalan ini MASIH TIDAK DI JAWAB OLEH KAMU, SEPH :



Dah pandai tuduh, lepas tu lari apabila di minta kamu buktikan kata2 kamu terhadap Muhammad s.a.w..... Mana sikap mulia yang di ajar oleh Vedas kamu?

Tolong jangan cerita pasal nak naikkan bangsa, nak naikkan agama, nak kuatkan agama, jika kamu sendiri tidak tahu menghormati kata-kata kamu sendiri!

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

Since my young days, I HAVE NEVER HEARD A SINGLE SERMONS THAT MOCKS AND LOWERS OTHER RELIGION'S STATUS. NOT EVEN HINDUISM.  

Then you must have been born deaf.

Now, question is, are you willing to attend such class and 'show the flaw in Islam', or are you just going to 'fight Islam' behind your pseudonym (which, I believe, you're not doing a very good job other than insulting yourself and your religion)?

Answer :- No, I will not be attending any classes because it is useless. What do you expect me to find in there? Proof Islam is true religion? Only people attending such classes are those who actually believe Islam is brought down by God. To me, Islam was brought in by a madman named Muhammad and supported (through Violence and persecution) by his four friends.

You might disagree, but I believe the rest of the readers can see who's the terrorist here.

I will not agree or disagree - because I DON'T CARE. You can give respect if you believe your religion told you to do so, but do not expect any in return.

Well, it's been few years and you didn't harm us nor Allah Himself.

You are very wrong.

The surah DENIES THE DIVINITY OF JESUS and even says that GOD CANNOT HAVE A SON. Now, WHICH CHRISTIAN WOULD AGREE TO THAT? If he wanted to wins the Christians, he shouldn't say things which GOES AGAINST THE TEACHINGS OF THE BIBLE.

Muhammad had no choice in the matter, as I stated earlier. Quraisy are complaining to Christian king, the Nexus that Muhammad was insulting Jesus and Muhammad have to stick with what he had taught (that Allah cannot have children) or he will risk losing his followers at early stage. However, he have to be careful not to piss of the Christians further, so he made Jesus into a prophet of highest standards to please the Christians and since Jews too have denied Jesus of being a Son of God and lived in peace with Christians, the Nexus were pleased with Muhammad's explanation and did not take actions. Question here was whether Muhammad insulted Jesus or not, not what status Muhammad placed Jesus in.

IF YOU SAY THAT QURAN IS NOT THE SOURCE, THEN WHICH 'ISLAM' ARE YOU REFERRING TO??

I have no idea what you are trying to say. It is obvious you have lost me somewhere.

Yes, kinda hard because you blatantly claimed that King Manu and Queen Anusia was the equaivalent of Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve doesn't have any parents, Seph. Now, you're telling me King Manu have parents?

Equivalent does NOT means the same. Have I stated that King Manu and Queen Anusia is Adam and Eve? No, I said EQUIVALENT which means they are similar (in status and situation) as Adam and Eve (minus the kicking out of the heaven part). Plus, they were not alone (or butt-naked), they were with seven other sages (humans) and their families as well. All whom are Humans' forefathers.

He was given this title by the people of Makkah LONG BEFORE HIS PROPHETHOOD. What does Al-Amin means? The Trustworthy.

And yet, it was the Quraisy who called him a liar when he went against their belief. So what is your point? Anyone can give another person a title, it doesn't mean that person is worth the title. In today's World, we see plenty of Snakes, robbers and thieves who are also Datins and Datuks. What's a big deal about titles?

ct_og

Sephiroth posted on 14-11-2013 10:06 AM
by ct_og

Perghh... kamu ni sombong sangat la walaupun jelas kamu tu dah banyak tak dapat jawab soalan orang-orang Islam.. bila tak dapat jawab mula le merepek maki hamun peribadi orang. Ala....kamu pun lahir hasil dari nafsu ibu dan bapa kamukan? Bukannya manusia ni malaikat tak ada nafsu... semua orang ada nafsu.... kamu pun takkan tak ada nafsu... kalau tak ada nafsu maknanya dah lama kamu mati tak mahu makan, minum dan buat apa-apa... sibuk beramal macam malaikat... Kamu aje menyeksa diri kamu tak kahwin tu pilihan kamu.... dalam Islam tak suruh pun begitu... kami buat apa yang Allah perintahkan sebab Allah tahu apa keperluan dan kehendak manusia.... tapi kalau tak kahwin tu maknanya itu adalah takdir Allah... Allah telah tentukan jodohnya di syurga jika dia benar-benar beriman dengan Allah... Allah janji nak jumpa hamba Nya yang beriman dalam syurga sebab tu ramai orang beriman yang nak masuk syurga bukan kerana sebab syurga itu disediakan nikmat untuk manusia tetapi sebab mahu bertemu dengan Allah. Kami beribadah semata-mata kerana Allah dan mahu bertemu dengan Allah... itulah kebahagian dan ketenangan yang tertinggi... Orang hindu ada ke peluang nak jumpa Tuhan kamu yang paling tinggi tu?

Sephiroth

by ct_og

Ala....kamu pun lahir hasil dari nafsu ibu dan bapa kamukan? Bukannya manusia ni malaikat tak ada nafsu... semua orang ada nafsu.... kamu pun takkan tak ada nafsu... kalau tak ada nafsu maknanya dah lama kamu mati ...

Tak payahlah kamu menyamakan diri kau dgn aku.

ct_og

Sephiroth posted on 15-11-2013 09:49 AM
by ct_og

ooo.. kalau saya manusia maka kamu tu bukan manusia ke? Ke kamu ni bukan manusia? Makhluk apa tu?

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 14-11-2013 02:55 PM
by Gunblade712

Then you must have been born deaf.

nope. I was born with enough senses, alhamdulillah. There are still no proof from you, showing that the khatib mocked other religions during Friday sermons. If what you claimed are true, then OBVIOUSLY you can give us proof, as the sermons were given using a loudspeaker and ALL OF THE PEOPLE can listen (both the Muslims and the non-Muslims).

Kalau tiada bukti, lebih baik kamu duduk diam2. Please stop humiliating yourself.

Answer :- No, I will not be attending any classes because it is useless. What do you expect me to find in there? Proof Islam is true religion? Only people attending such classes are those who actually believe Islam is brought down by God. To me, Islam was brought in by a madman named Muhammad and supported (through Violence and persecution) by his four friends.

Expections? Either you hear Islam from the right source (and stop throwing these fitnah which only degrades yourself) OR you can REBUKED AND SHOW TO THE MUSLIMS THERE HOW ISLAM IS A 'FALSE RELIGION'.

Another lie. As I've stated, I've attended classes in which there are non-muslims. Those who attends the Islamic classes are THOSE WHO WISHES TO KNOW ISLAM FROM THE RIGHT SOURCE, NOT TO ACCEPT ISLAM.

I will not agree or disagree - because I DON'T CARE. You can give respect if you believe your religion told you to do so, but do not expect any in return.

Well, I have high hopes towards the Vedas. Thank you for showing to us how Vedas actually taught you.

You are very wrong.

You cannot harm us (AND STILL HAVEN'T HARM US) unless Allah allows you to.

And you CAN NEVER HARM ALLAH. Throwing insults at Him is not harming him, but you're only harming yourself.

Muhammad had no choice in the matter, as I stated earlier. Quraisy are complaining to Christian king, the Nexus that Muhammad was insulting Jesus and Muhammad have to stick with what he had taught (that Allah cannot have children) or he will risk losing his followers at early stage. However, he have to be careful not to piss of the Christians further, so he made Jesus into a prophet of highest standards to please the Christians and since Jews too have denied Jesus of being a Son of God and lived in peace with Christians, the Nexus were pleased with Muhammad's explanation and did not take actions. Question here was whether Muhammad insulted Jesus or not, not what status Muhammad placed Jesus in.

The name of the King is Negus. Nexus tu nama phone.

Have you actually READ Surah Maryam? Your explanation just, don't make any sense. Not only the surah denies the divinity of Jesus (which is the centre of the Christian's belief) but also rejects those who believe that Jesus is the son of God.

That is Jesus, the son of Mary - the word of truth about which they are in dispute. It is not [befitting] for Allah to take a son; exalted is He! When He decrees an affair, He only says to it, "Be," and it is. [Jesus said], "And indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is a straight path." Then the factions differed [concerning Jesus] from among them, so woe to those who disbelieved - from the scene of a tremendous Day. (Surah Maryam : 34- 37).

That's a WARNING, Seph. Christians wouldn't feel comfortable if a bunch of stranger just comes to them and say 'Hey, Jesus is not the son of God, so woe to you if you still thinks that he is!".

And I'm STILL WAITING FOR PROOF that Muhammad s.a.w. changed Jesus's status IN MADINAH, seeing that you're the ones who give this claim as if it's the truth.

I have no idea what you are trying to say. It is obvious you have lost me somewhere.

lol. you've claimed that Muhammad s.a.w. travelled for 15 years before his prophethood, and then he came back with Islam. THIS IS YOUR ALLEGATION.

However, 'came back with Islam' MUST CARRIES the meaning that HE CAME BACK WITH THE QURAN, because HE WAS ANNOINTED AS A PROPHET BY ALLAH VIA BESTOWING UPON HIM A QURANIC VERSE (we are NOT TALKING ABOUT QURAN IN A BOOK FORM). Hence, for 15 years, he manages to 'create the Quran' and 'memorize it' to the people. THIS IS YOUR ALLEGATIONS.

still lost?

Equivalent does NOT means the same. Have I stated that King Manu and Queen Anusia is Adam and Eve? No, I said EQUIVALENT which means they are similar (in status and situation) as Adam and Eve (minus the kicking out of the heaven part). Plus, they were not alone (or butt-naked), they were with seven other sages (humans) and their families as well. All whom are Humans' forefathers.

So King Manu and Queen Anusia was NOT the first human lah? King Manu's parents, were they humans?

And yet, it was the Quraisy who called him a liar when he went against their belief. So what is your point? Anyone can give another person a title, it doesn't mean that person is worth the title. In today's World, we see plenty of Snakes, robbers and thieves who are also Datins and Datuks. What's a big deal about titles?

You truly haven't read the sirahtulnabawiyah, aye Seph?

Even though the Quraisy deemed him a liar, they entrusted him with their belongings whenever they went to war, stating to him to 'take care of our stuff' and 'return it to us if we return or return it back to my family if I don't'.

Even though they called him a 'liar', they do not actually believe that he's a 'liar'. They KNOW that he NEVER LIES.

btw, YOU ARE IGNORING THESE QUESTIONS WHICH WERE BASED ON YOUR ALLEGATIONS :



dah sedap menuduh, bila kami tanya, kamu LARI. MACAM NI KE KATA NAK 'BATTLE ISLAM AND ALLAH'? Baru kena tanya dah lari. Bukannya kita tanya pasal apa, kita tanya pasal PERTUDUHAN KAMU sahaja.

gunblade712

ct_og posted on 15-11-2013 10:24 AM
ooo.. kalau saya manusia maka kamu tu bukan manusia ke? Ke kamu ni bukan manusia? Makhluk apa tu?; ...

dari dulu lagi memang Seph suka memaki menghasut orang. tapi sampai skarang, takde hasil pun.

tengok sendirilah thread ni, brapa banyak soalan yang dia tak jawab? Soalan tu, bukan soalan personal, tapi soalan yang merujuk kepada tuduhan dia terhadap Islam.

apa yang dia buat boleh, adalah ASSUME dan TUDUH.

Sedih sebab ada lagi manusia macam ni atas muka bumi. Sombong!

Sephiroth

by Gunblade712

nope. I was born with enough senses, alhamdulillah.

Born physically is very different from born mentally. Many people have eyes but they choose not to see. They have ears but they choose not to listen. You (Muslims in general) are one such species.

... OR you can REBUKED AND SHOW TO THE MUSLIMS THERE HOW ISLAM IS A 'FALSE RELIGION'.

Islam is false because it brought chaos, strife and war upon Mankind. You kept arguing that actions of its followers cannot be used as proof in the past. WHY NOT? It is common among Malays to say "Kurang Ajar" to a child who misbehave in the public, referring to the parents unable to teach their child proper manners. So why it is hard to see that Muslims also "kurang ajar" by Islam, which by itself a proof that Islam is false. FACT - A TRUE RELIGION OF GOD CANNOT LEAD MANKIND ASTRAY.

And you CAN NEVER HARM ALLAH. Throwing insults at Him is not harming him, but you're only harming yourself.

Whatever.

That's a WARNING, Seph. Christians wouldn't feel comfortable if a bunch of stranger just comes to them and say 'Hey, Jesus is not the son of God, so woe to you if you still thinks that he is!".

FYI - Jews have been stating the same thing for over 300 years, so Christians are quite comfortable with "strangers" who denies Jesus. Perhaps Christians didn't care much about Muhammad or took him as a treat. Perhaps they though Muhammad is the problem of Quraisy (we all know that Abdul Mutalib still holds influence and protest Muhammad at this time, which is why Quraisy did not lynch him in Mecca) or perhaps Christians simply did not want to go to war with the Quraisy and risk trading agreement with them (over a single person). Whatever the case was, Jesus's status is not something anyone bothered that day.

lol. you've claimed that Muhammad s.a.w. travelled for 15 years before his prophethood, and then he came back with Islam. THIS IS YOUR ALLEGATION.

That is not allegation. We know for fact that Muhammad worked under Siti Khadijah who was a successful business woman and 20 years older than he was. We know that he worked for her for years before marrying her. Are you saying this is wrong? Or are you saying that he never travelled outside Mecca during this time?

HE WAS ANNOINTED AS A PROPHET BY ALLAH VIA BESTOWING UPON HIM A QURANIC VERSE ...

He wasn't anointed with anything. He was in Gua Hira when something approached him and he ran away scared back to his wife. Did Moses run away scared after God spoke to him through the burning bushes? Did any other prophets run away scared after God spoke to them?

So King Manu and Queen Anusia was NOT the first human lah? King Manu's parents, were they humans?

I never said King Manu and Queen Anusia was the first human. YOU DID. I only said that they are EQUIVALENT to Adam and Eve because modern human being are descended from them. You are the one who mistaken to think I had claimed that they were Adam and Eve like in the Bible. You made that mistake, not me.

Even though the Quraisy deemed him a liar, they entrusted him with their belongings whenever they went to war, stating to him to 'take care of our stuff' and 'return it to us if we return or return it back to my family if I don't'.

So Quraisy thought Muhammad was their servant boy? To hold onto their belongings till they returned? Or perhaps they looked down at Muhammad, seeing that he was just a boy unfit to fight with men in the battlefield?

ct_og

gunblade712 posted on 15-11-2013 12:38 PM
dari dulu lagi memang Seph suka memaki menghasut orang. tapi sampai skarang, takde hasil pun.

...

Apa nak buat... dia kesepian pasal tu namanya sepi_roh... memilih cara hidup bersendirian sebab takut nak bertanggung jawab ada anak bini.... last-last dok duduk kat sini konon-konon pengikut hindu yang amat taat...

Sephiroth

ct_og posted on 15-11-2013 04:20 PM
Apa nak buat... dia kesepian pasal tu namanya sepi_roh... memilih cara hidup bersendirian sebab ta ...

Hmph, kau ingatlah kata2 kamu itu. Kerana satu hari nanti, kamu akan melutut di kaki aku meminta belas kasihan juga nanti.

ct_og

Sephiroth posted on 15-11-2013 04:32 PM
Hmph, kau ingatlah kata2 kamu itu. Kerana satu hari nanti, kamu akan melutut di kaki aku meminta b ...

oohh ya ke... apasal lak saya nak melutut pada kamu? Sori le... harap saya tak jumpa kamu kat akhirat kelak... kalau kamu marah saya sebab panggil kamu sepi-roh... saya minta maaf le.. ingatkan kamu tak marah sebab kamukan memang suka perli-perli dan main-mainkan nama orangkan?

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 15-11-2013 04:32 PM
Hmph, kau ingatlah kata2 kamu itu. Kerana satu hari nanti, kamu akan melutut di kaki aku meminta b ...

macam mana nak 'melutut' kalau ajak berbincang depan2 pun kau lari dan tak mahu jumpa?

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 15-11-2013 04:16 PM
by Gunblade712

Born physically is very different from born mentally. Many people have eyes but they choose not to see. They have ears but they choose not to listen. You (Muslims in general) are one such species.

Well then, SHOW to us proof that we degrade other religion during our friday sermons.

You can't even give A SINGLE PROOF, and yet you're claiming that we do not listen?

btw, today, the Friday sermon speaks about financial and avoiding riba' in Islam. Didn't mention anything about other religion, though. Still waiting for you to give us proof. If you can't, then you're just LYING. Penipu dan penyebar fitnah adalah jijik di mata mana2 agama pun, termasuklah agama Hindu kamu tu!

Islam is false because it brought chaos, strife and war upon Mankind. You kept arguing that actions of its followers cannot be used as proof in the past. WHY NOT? It is common among Malays to say "Kurang Ajar" to a child who misbehave in the public, referring to the parents unable to teach their child proper manners. So why it is hard to see that Muslims also "kurang ajar" by Islam, which by itself a proof that Islam is false. FACT - A TRUE RELIGION OF GOD CANNOT LEAD MANKIND ASTRAY.

Oh please! Now you're jumping from one point to another. You don't have enough bravery to walk up to one, simple, humble, Islamic class and "REBUKE" ISLAM IN FRONT OF US, correct? So stay there with your cowardice.

'TRUE RELIGION OF GOD CANNOT LEAD MANKIND ASTRAY". Are you telling us that Hinduism doesn't lead mankind astray? Oh please Seph, stop bringing up issues that will only shame you and tarnish your own religion.

Whatever.

LOL K. still cannot harm us, though.

FYI - Jews have been stating the same thing for over 300 years, so Christians are quite comfortable with "strangers" who denies Jesus. Perhaps Christians didn't care much about Muhammad or took him as a treat. Perhaps they though Muhammad is the problem of Quraisy (we all know that Abdul Mutalib still holds influence and protest Muhammad at this time, which is why Quraisy did not lynch him in Mecca) or perhaps Christians simply did not want to go to war with the Quraisy and risk trading agreement with them (over a single person). Whatever the case was, Jesus's status is not something anyone bothered that day.

Aduhai. Aku cakap kau belit kang, kau marah Seph. YOU are the ones who brought up the issue about Muhammad s.a.w "changed the status of Jesus Christ", and now you're telling me that it's not something that anyone bothered?

Allow me to quote your own words :

Seph's post #56 :

Jews and Christians were supportive of Muhammad when he was in Mecca, therefore, when he qouted from their beliefs, they simply thought that he was doing what all prophets before him was doing, reteaching the people of their beliefs. It is in Madinah did Muhammad started to change the text to his will, and omitted out many things, including the status of Jesus as Son of God and changing the direction of prayers from Jerusalem (which the Jews had been doing for over 500 years) toward Kaabah, which they never had heard or done before. At that time, it was too late. Muhammad already have his war-mongering horde and started to attack and capture areas around Medinah. Jews and Christians fought back with the only way they could - by supporting the Quraisy but the Quraisy are too stupid to do an all-out attack to wipe Muhammad out and lost in return.

Besides, I have yet to hear from you, the proof that Muhammad s.a.w. "changed Jesus Christ's status in Madinah". Do you have the proof, or is this just ANOTHER LIES AND FITNAH that you're throwing to Islam?

That is not allegation. We know for fact that Muhammad worked under Siti Khadijah who was a successful business woman and 20 years older than he was. We know that he worked for her for years before marrying her. Are you saying this is wrong? Or are you saying that he never travelled outside Mecca during this time?

He wasn't anointed with anything. He was in Gua Hira when something approached him and he ran away scared back to his wife. Did Moses run away scared after God spoke to him through the burning bushes? Did any other prophets run away scared after God spoke to them?

Well, thank you for stating both of these.

Now, the 'Islam' that Muhammad s.a.w. taught the people is based on the QURAN THAT WAS REVEALED TO HIM IN THE HIRA' CAVE. Regardless of whether you agree to the anointment or not, HE DID PREACHED THE QURAN. Ergo, the 'ISLAM' that you CLAIMED MUHAMMAD s.a.w "HAVE CREATED DURING HIS TRAVEL" IS ALL IN THE QURAN.

That is why I asked you, WHO WAS HIS TEACHER? Makkah is a trading centre and if Muhammad s.a.w. can GO TO A LAND TO DO BUSINESS, then OBVIOUSLY THE PEOPLE FROM THAT LAND CAN COME TO MAKKAH AND DO BUSINESS.

You are telling me that during his prophethood, NO ONE ROSE AND CLAIMED THAT MUHAMMAD s.a.w. PLAGIARIST HIS/HER TEACHINGS OR HIS/HER TEACHER'S TEACHING; BUT YOU'RE STATING THAT MUHAMMAD HAD A TEACHER?

ini sungguh FACEPALM. Do you or do you NOT have a name to strongly support your allegations that Muhammad s.a.w stole/gained knowledge during his travelling days?

I never said King Manu and Queen Anusia was the first human. YOU DID. I only said that they are EQUIVALENT to Adam and Eve because modern human being are descended from them. You are the one who mistaken to think I had claimed that they were Adam and Eve like in the Bible. You made that mistake, not me.

Well you are the ones who gave the idea. but for the sake of the discussion, I apologize for mistakenly assume that you're stating that King Manu and Queen Anusia is the same as Adam and Eve.

So, who was their father? And who was the first, first, ever, human being created by God (according to Hinduism)? And who gave the first, first, ever human being, his/her name?

So Quraisy thought Muhammad was their servant boy? To hold onto their belongings till they returned? Or perhaps they looked down at Muhammad, seeing that he was just a boy unfit to fight with men in the battlefield?

Nope. If you KNOW the Arabs during Muhammad's time, you WOULD SUREEELY KNOW that they have TRIBES. The war that I'm telling is not between the Quraisy (Muhammad s.a.w's tribe). It's between other tribes. You DO KNOW that Quraisy is one of the strongest tribe during that time. It would be crazy to go to war with the Quraisy during that time.

Seeing that you always speaks about Muhammad, you must SURELY KNOW ALL OF THE ABOVE FACT, riiiiiiigghhtt?

So, of all the people in Makkah, the people who wanted to go to war entrusted their belongings to Muhammad s.a.w, even though they claimed to have hated Muhammad s.a.w. due to his preachings.

That's Al-Amin. He was trusted even before he was a prophet. Oh, did you know WHAT DID MUHAMMAD S.A.W SAID DURING HIS FIRST, FIRST EVER PUBLIC PREACHING?

Surely you must know, seeing that you're speaking about Muhammad s.a.w as if you memorize his sirah!

gunblade712

Sephiroth posted on 15-11-2013 04:16 PM
by Gunblade712

Please be responsible for your own words and answer these questions :



Jangan jadi manusia jijik yang hanya tahu menuduh/memfitnah kemudian lari apabila berhadapan dengan soalan.